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marnixR
Post  Post subject: public pay cap  |  Posted: Mon Sep 11, 2017 6:49 am
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don't know if people outside the UK are aware of it, but the public sector has had a pay cap since 2013, and had been frozen in the years prior to that since 2010

I'm not here to debate the rights or wrongs of the pay freeze / cap (although I can see the economics behind it), but rather how the press reports it - whenever they give examples of public sector workers it always appears to be highly visible roles such as firefighters, nurses or bobbies on the beat

however, I wonder how representative these examples are for the general population of public workers at large - in other words, while people might sympathise with high profile jobs such as the ones mentioned above, do they only represent a small percentage of public workers, and the majority are desk workers whose job is neither life threatening or essential to someone else's health

people who deal with the state pension, for instance, or customs officers at the airport, or the civil servants who are to implement the government policy: is their situation such that they should feel entitled to a better than the 1% pay cap ?

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janus
Post  Post subject: Re: public pay cap  |  Posted: Tue Sep 12, 2017 3:53 pm

Joined: Mon Dec 28, 2015 7:11 pm
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marnixR wrote:
don't know if people outside the UK are aware of it, but the public sector has had a pay cap since 2013, and had been frozen in the years prior to that since 2010

I'm not here to debate the rights or wrongs of the pay freeze / cap (although I can see the economics behind it), but rather how the press reports it - whenever they give examples of public sector workers it always appears to be highly visible roles such as firefighters, nurses or bobbies on the beat

however, I wonder how representative these examples are for the general population of public workers at large - in other words, while people might sympathise with high profile jobs such as the ones mentioned above, do they only represent a small percentage of public workers, and the majority are desk workers whose job is neither life threatening or essential to someone else's health

people who deal with the state pension, for instance, or customs officers at the airport, or the civil servants who are to implement the government policy: is their situation such that they should feel entitled to a better than the 1% pay cap ?


I guess my question would be, does that 1% cap allow them to keep up with the cost of living? It it always easy to find someone who can be argued makes too little or too much for the job they do. Depending on which side of the argument you come down on, you will focus on one over the other.

I've seen the same type of tactic used the other way. In my state is the US, public employees have a pension system which basically works by a certain percentage of their wages being put into a plan that gathers interest, and when they retire, their pension is paid based on how much money they have in their account upon retirement. Thus the more someone made while working, the larger their pension payments. Opponents to the system who complain that it is too generous, always use as their example the highest paid public employees. One of their favorite examples recently was a sports coach for one of our public universities. When he retired, they pointed out the large amount he would get from his pension ( Never mind the fact that the reason he was getting this large pension was because of the ridiculous sum he was paid to coach a college sports team).

The thing is that they did not use this fact to say that the system should be overhauled to place an upper cap on the pension payouts, but that the pension payouts should be cut across the board. Just trimming the pensions of the top earners wouldn't cut the total costs of the pension payouts very much since these earners only represent a small percentage of the payees. To reach their goal of reducing the cost of the system, they have to reduce the pensions of the much larger percentage of low earners. But they would get much traction going directly after them, as their individual pension payments would seem reasonable to the public. So they go after the outliers, with the implication that they are indicative of the system as a whole.


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marnixR
Post  Post subject: Re: public pay cap  |  Posted: Tue Sep 12, 2017 4:55 pm
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no the 1% cap does not keep up with the rate of inflation
howeve, the reasoning goes, the cap brings the public sector pay rise in line with what usually is available in the private sector, so why should you expect preferential treatment, just because you had a churchy deal until 2010 ?

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Prometheus
Post  Post subject: Re: public pay cap  |  Posted: Sat Sep 16, 2017 12:52 pm
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In terms of UK healthcare the pay cap is for anyone on a specific pay grade system. That includes secretaries and nursing assistants to managers and PAs. It does not include doctors as they are an articulate and educated lot and are much more able to negotiate better deals for their profession.

Not too sure how it works with porters and cleaners though, as these services are sub-contracted out.


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