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marnixR
Post  Post subject: heroes / role models  |  Posted: Sun Feb 19, 2017 7:28 pm
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sometimes I hear people describe how they became the person they were because of someone who was their hero or because they followed someone who was their role model

I must admit that this has never applied in my circumstances : I never had heroes or role models

which brings me to the question : am I the odd one out, or is this (i.e. not having heroes or role models) pretty standard ?

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DrKrettin
Post  Post subject: Re: heroes / role models  |  Posted: Sun Feb 19, 2017 8:26 pm
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marnixR wrote:
s am I the odd one out, or is this (i.e. not having heroes or role models) pretty standard ?


I think you are in a minority (to which I belong too). Celebrities make fortunes by selling crap which people buy because they see the celebrity as a role model. That is the reason celebrities are so famous - role models for the intellectually challenged.


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marnixR
Post  Post subject: Re: heroes / role models  |  Posted: Sun Feb 19, 2017 8:55 pm
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I don't get it though - take for instance David Attenborough : I think he's done a great deal of good work in bringing the wonder of nature to the public, but while I may admire his endeavour, that doesn't make him a saint, and I feel no inclination to emulate his example

or when it comes to music, I greatly admire (most) of the albums and songs by Dave Edmunds, but I don't know what he's like as a person, and see no reason to everything that comes out of his mouth as absolute gospel

quite possibly I'm just too cynical, thinking that behind every great man or woman hides a lesser real person

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wireless
Post  Post subject: Re: heroes / role models  |  Posted: Sun Feb 19, 2017 10:44 pm

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At the moment I can not think of any serious role models however my heroes abound. They come in no chronological order, or order of preference. Ivanhoe, Robin Hood, Richard The Lion Heart, John Wayne, Winston Churchill, Enoch Powell, Baden Powell, Alan Turing, Albert Einstein, Margaret Thatcher, Donald Trump, Nigel Farage, Florence Nightingale, Duke of Wellington, Johnny Depp, Bruce Willis, Ben Affleck, Mel Gibson, Peter Tatchell, Cecil Rhodes, Colonel H Jones, Kenny Everett, Theresa May, Joe Calzaghe, Sebastian Coe, Klitschko brothers, Richard Kilty, Roger Moore, Vinny Jones, Laura Muir, That will do for starters.


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iNow
Post  Post subject: Re: heroes / role models  |  Posted: Mon Feb 20, 2017 12:17 am
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There are people I respect and appreciate, but like you I don't tend to have heroes or role models.

I recognize we're all flawed and find it silly and simple minded to put people on pedestals or act as if they're somehow beyond human. It may be a personality trait related to independent and critical thinking perhaps.

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marnixR
Post  Post subject: Re: heroes / role models  |  Posted: Mon Feb 20, 2017 12:18 pm
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wireless wrote:
At the moment I can not think of any serious role models however my heroes abound. They come in no chronological order, or order of preference. Ivanhoe, Robin Hood, Richard The Lion Heart, John Wayne, Winston Churchill, Enoch Powell, Baden Powell, Alan Turing, Albert Einstein, Margaret Thatcher, Donald Trump, Nigel Farage, Florence Nightingale, Duke of Wellington, Johnny Depp, Bruce Willis, Ben Affleck, Mel Gibson, Peter Tatchell, Cecil Rhodes, Colonel H Jones, Kenny Everett, Theresa May, Joe Calzaghe, Sebastian Coe, Klitschko brothers, Richard Kilty, Roger Moore, Vinny Jones, Laura Muir, That will do for starters.


so clearly you make a distinction between heroes and role models - what is it in those people that make them heroes but make them fall short of being a role model ? apart from the fact that emulating Robin Hood would likely make you end up in jail

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Falconer360
Post  Post subject: Re: heroes / role models  |  Posted: Thu Feb 23, 2017 12:35 am
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I've never had anyone that I've thought of as a role model or a hero. When forced to write an essay on who my hero was in freshman year of college I chose Hunter S Thompson as a joke. It pissed off my English teacher who thought that he was more of a criminal than a hero. Good times...

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iNow
Post  Post subject: Re: heroes / role models  |  Posted: Thu Feb 23, 2017 1:24 am
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If I were given a mandate to choose someone, Carl Sagan approaches that status for me, and maybe folks like Newton or even Euclid.

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LilSaber
Post  Post subject: Re: heroes / role models  |  Posted: Thu Feb 23, 2017 1:45 am

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Gonna be lame and say my dad.


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marnixR
Post  Post subject: Re: heroes / role models  |  Posted: Thu Feb 23, 2017 7:53 am
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not lame at all - imo that's more likely to be real than having Euclid or Newton as a hero, since we either don't know them as people, or in the case of Newton, what we know is that of a very difficult person to deal with

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wireless
Post  Post subject: Re: heroes / role models  |  Posted: Thu Feb 23, 2017 7:13 pm

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marnixR wrote:
wireless wrote:
At the moment I can not think of any serious role models however my heroes abound. They come in no chronological order, or order of preference. Ivanhoe, Robin Hood, Richard The Lion Heart, John Wayne, Winston Churchill, Enoch Powell, Baden Powell, Alan Turing, Albert Einstein, Margaret Thatcher, Donald Trump, Nigel Farage, Florence Nightingale, Duke of Wellington, Johnny Depp, Bruce Willis, Ben Affleck, Mel Gibson, Peter Tatchell, Cecil Rhodes, Colonel H Jones, Kenny Everett, Theresa May, Joe Calzaghe, Sebastian Coe, Klitschko brothers, Richard Kilty, Roger Moore, Vinny Jones, Laura Muir, That will do for starters.


so clearly you make a distinction between heroes and role models - what is it in those people that make them heroes but make them fall short of being a role model ? apart from the fact that emulating Robin Hood would likely make you end up in jail

I would think that emulating Enoch Powell nowadays, may get you put in jail. I am very surprised that I am the one in a minority for having heroes. However with my newly found minority status, perhaps I can claim some kind of discrimination. Out of all the people that I mentioned, some living, some deceased, some fictional, I know an uncle of one of the people living.


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wireless
Post  Post subject: Re: heroes / role models  |  Posted: Thu Feb 23, 2017 7:18 pm

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Falconer360 wrote:
I've never had anyone that I've thought of as a role model or a hero. When forced to write an essay on who my hero was in freshman year of college I chose Hunter S Thompson as a joke. It pissed off my English teacher who thought that he was more of a criminal than a hero. Good times...

I do find it strange that you have never had any heroes. How can anyone grow up without any heroes ?


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marnixR
Post  Post subject: Re: heroes / role models  |  Posted: Thu Feb 23, 2017 7:31 pm
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wireless wrote:
I do find it strange that you have never had any heroes. How can anyone grow up without any heroes ?


that's what i've been wondering myself too - how come i never felt like hero-worshipping anyone ? maybe i'm empathy defective ?

because, despite you being in the minority on this forum, i do have the impression that in the population at large you're not + i was wondering why that would be the case

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iNow
Post  Post subject: Re: heroes / role models  |  Posted: Thu Feb 23, 2017 8:19 pm
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When I was growing up, my hero was He-Man and maybe Lion-O from the Thundercats. Then something magical happened... I grew up

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wireless
Post  Post subject: Re: heroes / role models  |  Posted: Thu Feb 23, 2017 8:27 pm

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iNow wrote:
When I was growing up, my hero was He-Man and maybe Lion-O from the Thundercats. Then something magical happened... I grew up

The vast majority of my heroes are not make believe, but heroes are heroes, and you had some heroes.


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Falconer360
Post  Post subject: Re: heroes / role models  |  Posted: Fri Feb 24, 2017 12:21 am
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wireless wrote:
Falconer360 wrote:
I've never had anyone that I've thought of as a role model or a hero. When forced to write an essay on who my hero was in freshman year of college I chose Hunter S Thompson as a joke. It pissed off my English teacher who thought that he was more of a criminal than a hero. Good times...

I do find it strange that you have never had any heroes. How can anyone grow up without any heroes ?

I guess when I was a small child the Green Ranger from Power Rangers was my hero, but he wasn't my role model. I basically just wanted to look cool doing martial arts and have the abilities of a Power Ranger. Since my original post I've talked with my mom, and apparently when I was three I idolized Spock from Star Trek. She said it always weirded her out because I would try to emulate his mannerisms and lack of emotion.

After I was about five is when I stopped all hero worship or whatever you want to call it.

In a lot of ways I'm like Marnix on this subject. There are a lot of people that I think are great, but they're not without their flaws. They're all just people.

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"For every moment of triumph, for every instance of beauty, many souls must be trampled." Hunter S Thompson
"It is easy to kill someone with a slash of a sword. It is hard to be impossible for others to cut down" - Yagyu Munenori


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iNow
Post  Post subject: Re: heroes / role models  |  Posted: Fri Feb 24, 2017 1:01 am
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Falconer360 wrote:
In a lot of ways I'm like Marnix on this subject. There are a lot of people that I think are great, but they're not without their flaws. They're all just people.

^this

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Lynx_Fox
Post  Post subject: Re: heroes / role models  |  Posted: Sat Feb 25, 2017 9:13 am

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Many over the years. Heroes I admired while younger were Jacque Cousteau for bringing science into one of our two channels growing up; and later Carl Sagan, for having the courage to speak science the public something unpopular with his peers. Once an adult, a figure from history, Earnest Shackleton for his diverse and often amazingly effective leadership in the worst conditions imaginable. President Obama over the past eight years, for showing amazing grace and thoughtfulness while broadening liberties and in many ways raising people's potential despite the growth of an almost obsessive anti-intellectual and intolerant resistance (and I say this as a Republic completely disgusted with what's happened to my own party). And there are many more, mostly unknown such as Dr. Downs, a college school professor who recognised my own potential in a high-school dropout and went to bat for me to get me into college on a probationary semester that changed my life. Mr. Williams, a man run over by a log truck, who persevered through his missing leg and crippled arm to still run a successful Saab dealership, boat builder, historic vessel restorer, coastal sailer, and run an art gallery--he was a close friend. I've taken bits and pieces and used them as role models as I've always given myself to the nation, and now community as a very busy volunteer. Life would be so much less without their examples in my life.


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geordief
Post  Post subject: Re: heroes / role models  |  Posted: Sat Feb 25, 2017 11:00 am

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So a hero is anyone who can show the way to others who would otherwise find it hard to follow a course of action.

The presupposition is that we all have something in common. We would have no interest in a "hero" that was superior or "other" to us in all ways.

There might be only one area where we might feel we have something in common with some "hero" but that would be enough for the hero identity to develop like the pearl in the oyster.

The image that comes to my mind is the primitive tribe confronting an enemy tribe in a territorial dispute where a hero does something the others were frightened or otherwise prevented from doing. The hero is successful and the others have learned a lesson in what is possible.

If the hero has died then his/her hero status can be a way of preserving the memory /lesson.

I am reading a book at the moment (Star of the Sea by J.O'Connor) where a father reveals his vulnerability to his son only to violently banish him in the next breath for letting him down as he sees it .

That is a bit confusing ...

PS Is the "hero " and the "demigod" the same character -someone with a foot in both camps?


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LilSaber
Post  Post subject: Re: heroes / role models  |  Posted: Sun Feb 26, 2017 2:34 am

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marnixR wrote:
not lame at all - imo that's more likely to be real than having Euclid or Newton as a hero, since we either don't know them as people, or in the case of Newton, what we know is that of a very difficult person to deal with


I didn't know that. It just felt like an obvious answer. He's always said I'm smart. I'm not that smart, honestly, but I appreciate positive words.


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