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Rory
Post  Post subject: Financing the fight against climate change  |  Posted: Tue May 31, 2016 4:19 pm
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http://www.ted.com/talks/michael_metcalfe_a_provocative_way_to_finance_the_fight_against_climate_change

Interesting idea... but would probably be better to incentivise by outcome rather than performance, since it is too easy to fudge performance data.

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iNow
Post  Post subject: Re: Financing the fight against climate change  |  Posted: Tue May 31, 2016 4:42 pm
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I'm lacking time to sit through a bunch of TED talks. Suspect I'm not the only one. Maybe you could provide a synopsis and a few points for us to discuss here?

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Rory
Post  Post subject: Re: Financing the fight against climate change  |  Posted: Tue May 31, 2016 6:24 pm
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Print money in the same way as happened in response to the 2008 financial crisis (do "whatever it takes")... check for hyperinflation issues... use the money to fund green technologies and to incentivise efforts to reduce CO2 emissions.

At least, that's my understanding of it.

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iNow
Post  Post subject: Re: Financing the fight against climate change  |  Posted: Tue May 31, 2016 7:18 pm
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Thanks! It's a good point. It really would be simple to achieve. We frankly wouldn't even need to print money, simply reallocate funds currently being used to subsidize oil and coal.

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exchemist
Post  Post subject: Re: Financing the fight against climate change  |  Posted: Wed Jun 01, 2016 10:31 am

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iNow wrote:
Thanks! It's a good point. It really would be simple to achieve. We frankly wouldn't even need to print money, simply reallocate funds currently being used to subsidize oil and coal.


What subsidies are these? Is this a US thing that we in Europe would not know about?

My understanding is that in Europe oil at least is extremely heavily TAXED. So quite the opposite of being subsidised.


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iNow
Post  Post subject: Re: Financing the fight against climate change  |  Posted: Wed Jun 01, 2016 12:15 pm
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It's hardly just the US doing it. See below (click images to enlarge):

Image


Image


Image

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Robittybob1
Post  Post subject: Re: Financing the fight against climate change  |  Posted: Wed Jun 01, 2016 1:18 pm

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Rory wrote:
http://www.ted.com/talks/michael_metcalfe_a_provocative_way_to_finance_the_fight_against_climate_change

Interesting idea... but would probably be better to incentivise by outcome rather than performance, since it is too easy to fudge performance data.

What would they spend this additional money on?


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iNow
Post  Post subject: Re: Financing the fight against climate change  |  Posted: Wed Jun 01, 2016 2:02 pm
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Green energy subsidy, electric vehicles, battery storage tech, job retraining for people currently in the fossil fuel industry, carbon capture tech, infrastructure to support these moves, etc.

How do you think these funds should be allocated?

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Rory
Post  Post subject: Re: Financing the fight against climate change  |  Posted: Wed Jun 01, 2016 2:53 pm
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Having said this... last night I re-watched Daniel Pink's awesome TED talk on the role of autonomy, mastery and purpose in human motivation... in which he argues that carrot-stick methods do not advance motivation for any task requiring even rudimentary cognitive input. (He uses the candle problem as an analogy).

So, perhaps, providing financial incentives will not help to solve the ultimate 'candle problem' (climate change).

I should probably stop watching TED talks... but TV is too boring. ;)

http://www.ted.com/talks/dan_pink_on_motivation?language=en

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Robittybob1
Post  Post subject: Re: Financing the fight against climate change  |  Posted: Wed Jun 01, 2016 8:33 pm

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iNow wrote:
Green energy subsidy, electric vehicles, battery storage tech, job retraining for people currently in the fossil fuel industry, carbon capture tech, infrastructure to support these moves, etc.

How do you think these funds should be allocated?

Looking at your list the one that I feel is most important is carbon capture. There is so much carbon locked up as potential methane forming material and methane hydrates that if this carbon is released by warming (which is the release mechanism), even a percentage of it, the Earth is going to experience a runaway global warming.

So can humans balance this by extracting carbon at a similar rate.
It will be difficult.


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Falconer360
Post  Post subject: Re: Financing the fight against climate change  |  Posted: Wed Jun 01, 2016 9:09 pm
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Robittybob1 wrote:
There is so much carbon locked up as potential methane forming material and methane hydrates that if this carbon is released by warming (which is the release mechanism), even a percentage of it, the Earth is going to experience a runaway global warming. .


What I honestly wonder is if this will be a runaway global warming event on scale with what happened to Venus? Is the state of Venus what our future looks like? Or will it be less severe and still be survivable for some species, and just be a climate similar to the Paleocene-Eocene Thermal Maximum?

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Robittybob1
Post  Post subject: Re: Financing the fight against climate change  |  Posted: Wed Jun 01, 2016 9:30 pm

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Falconer360 wrote:
Robittybob1 wrote:
There is so much carbon locked up as potential methane forming material and methane hydrates that if this carbon is released by warming (which is the release mechanism), even a percentage of it, the Earth is going to experience a runaway global warming. .


What I honestly wonder is if this will be a runaway global warming event on scale with what happened to Venus? Is the state of Venus what our future looks like? Or will it be less severe and still be survivable for some species, and just be a climate similar to the Paleocene-Eocene Thermal Maximum?

Hopefully we won't let this happen.
My own feeling is that the entire atmosphere has changed so it would be worse than anything in the past. It seems like an ultimate fate of the Earth but can we delay it? Maybe we should not have extracted oil and coal, but we can't turn back the clock on that.
I've got to keep positive.


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iNow
Post  Post subject: Re: Financing the fight against climate change  |  Posted: Wed Jun 01, 2016 10:22 pm
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Robittybob1 wrote:
It seems like an ultimate fate of the Earth but can we delay it?

Of course, we can. Using ideas such as those described in the OP, for example, but there are countless others.

It's not a lack of technology or ability (or even funding, for that matter) that's stopping us from addressing this. It's lack of political will and too much ideological obstructionism.

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Robittybob1
Post  Post subject: Re: Financing the fight against climate change  |  Posted: Thu Jun 02, 2016 4:31 am

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iNow wrote:
Robittybob1 wrote:
It seems like an ultimate fate of the Earth but can we delay it?

Of course, we can. Using ideas such as those described in the OP, for example, but there are countless others.

It's not a lack of technology or ability (or even funding, for that matter) that's stopping us from addressing this. It's lack of political will and too much ideological obstructionism.

What I meant by "ultimate fate" is that sometime in the future, the methane will be released and we will get a runaway greenhouse gas issue. We can delay it, remedy the present situation we are in, for the short term (next (n) thousands of years). I can't see a solution to take away that threat.
I'm all for remedying the current crisis before it gets too bad. I have seen some say we are too late already, but let's try at least.


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