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Ryndanangnysen
Post  Post subject: How come we never went to the moon?  |  Posted: Sun Jul 26, 2015 4:29 pm

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By now it is rather obvious that we have never sent men to the moon.
So, the question now becomes why?


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marnixR
Post  Post subject: Re: How come we never went to the moon?  |  Posted: Sun Jul 26, 2015 6:34 pm
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first reaction : why should it be obvious ?

secondly, here's xkcd's reply to all the conspiracy theorists :

Image

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Ryndanangnysen
Post  Post subject: Re: How come we never went to the moon?  |  Posted: Sun Jul 26, 2015 6:58 pm

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marnixR wrote:
first reaction : why should it be obvious ?

secondly, here's xkcd's reply to all the conspiracy theorists :




Well, that can hardly be called an argument eh? It is just a statement about your believe and nothing more.


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marnixR
Post  Post subject: Re: How come we never went to the moon?  |  Posted: Sun Jul 26, 2015 8:09 pm
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so where does your belief come from, which can only come from a sense of disbelief about what appears to be good evidence that we did go to the moon

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Ryndanangnysen
Post  Post subject: Re: How come we never went to the moon?  |  Posted: Sun Jul 26, 2015 8:24 pm

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marnixR wrote:
so where does your belief come from, which can only come from a sense of disbelief about what appears to be good evidence that we did go to the moon


of course I have believed for years that we have send people to the moon,
Until I found some strange things and I dismissed them at first. I thought the idea was ridiculous.
But to be fair, I hadn't researched any of this. So I started and now after years of researching this, I am convinced we never went to the moon. Or better we have never put a man on the moon. It realy is all a hoax.




Now, about the evidence you are talking about. What is that evidence?


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marnixR
Post  Post subject: Re: How come we never went to the moon?  |  Posted: Mon Jul 27, 2015 7:27 am
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my evidence is what you obviously tend to disbelieve, which is that the pictures and movies are what they appear to be

on top of that :
telescopes now have the resolution to see the remains of the LEM on the moon
the equipment left behind still records moon quakes
other equipment (retro-reflectors) allow anyone with the right equipment to point a laser at them and measure the distance to the moon
moon rocks were returned that are geologically clearly different from earth rocks
i have recently been in Jodrell Bank which tracked the Apollo crafts going to the moon

+ 2 arguments from disbelief :

do you really think the Russians wouldn't have tried their utmost to expose the US if they knew it was a hoax ?
secondly, many thousands of people would have keep a really, really big secret, and not a single one decided to blab ?

the improbablity of both above statements is such that they approach and in my view equate an impossibility

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Ryndanangnysen
Post  Post subject: Re: How come we never went to the moon?  |  Posted: Mon Jul 27, 2015 10:10 am

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marnixR wrote:
my evidence is what you obviously tend to disbelieve, which is that the pictures and movies are what they appear to be

on top of that :
telescopes now have the resolution to see the remains of the LEM on the moon
the equipment left behind still records moon quakes
other equipment (retro-reflectors) allow anyone with the right equipment to point a laser at them and measure the distance to the moon
moon rocks were returned that are geologically clearly different from earth rocks
i have recently been in Jodrell Bank which tracked the Apollo crafts going to the moon

+ 2 arguments from disbelief :

do you really think the Russians wouldn't have tried their utmost to expose the US if they knew it was a hoax ?
secondly, many thousands of people would have keep a really, really big secret, and not a single one decided to blab ?

the improbablity of both above statements is such that they approach and in my view equate an impossibility


ok, well let's see.

Quote:
telescopes now have the resolution to see the remains of the LEM on the moon


Can you show me?

Quote:
the equipment left behind still records moon quakes


How do you know it was put there by men and not by robots or machines?


Quote:
other equipment (retro-reflectors) allow anyone with the right equipment to point a laser at them and measure the distance to the moon


The reflectors haven't been put there by men on the moon but by machines.


Quote:
moon rocks were returned that are geologically clearly different from earth rocks


really? Are you sure. Some of them turned out to be fake!How about that?

Quote:
i have recently been in Jodrell Bank which tracked the Apollo crafts going to the moon


please explain.This is tooo little.

Quote:
do you really think the Russians wouldn't have tried their utmost to expose the US if they knew it was a hoax ?


Did you know what the Russian did was a hoax too?


Quote:
secondly, many thousands of people would have keep a really, really big secret, and not a single one decided to blab ?


It isn't about thousands of people. maybe hundred probably less. t has been proven that they can keep their mouth shut for years.


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marnixR
Post  Post subject: Re: How come we never went to the moon?  |  Posted: Mon Jul 27, 2015 4:26 pm
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your disbelief is not based on any evidence - the way you go about it i could not even prove that the moon is not made of cheese

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Ryndanangnysen
Post  Post subject: Re: How come we never went to the moon?  |  Posted: Mon Jul 27, 2015 4:53 pm

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marnixR wrote:
your disbelief is not based on any evidence - the way you go about it i could not even prove that the moon is not made of cheese


Really? well, lets start here, How come the moon rocks where fake? How is that for evidence?


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iNow
Post  Post subject: Re: How come we never went to the moon?  |  Posted: Tue Jul 28, 2015 6:02 pm
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http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Moon_landing_hoax

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marnixR
Post  Post subject: Re: How come we never went to the moon?  |  Posted: Tue Jul 28, 2015 8:40 pm
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interesting, that :

RationalWiki wrote:
"Vedic fundamentalism - A few hardline followers of the Hare Krishna movement refuse to accept the landings, because it would contradict what their holy texts say about the Moon (for example, that it is further away than the Sun, surrounded by fire and ice, and the source of planetary vegetation). This attitude dates back to the founder of the movement and the time of the landings themselves


remember that one of Ryndanangnysen's other threads was about "Vedic or Galactic Mathematics "

so that's where it all comes from, not just a nutter, a religious nutter to boot

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Falconer360
Post  Post subject: Re: How come we never went to the moon?  |  Posted: Tue Jul 28, 2015 10:26 pm
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Hooray for religious nutters!! Wait... Er... No... I mean Boo religious nutters. At least that explains things. Thanks for doing the research fishman!

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marnixR
Post  Post subject: Re: How come we never went to the moon?  |  Posted: Wed Jul 29, 2015 9:00 pm
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have you ever tried googling "Ryndanangnysen"? he appears to be a rather busy person and i wouldn't be surprised if he had been banned on many another one

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Falconer360
Post  Post subject: Re: How come we never went to the moon?  |  Posted: Fri Jul 31, 2015 8:08 pm
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marnixR wrote:
have you ever tried googling "Ryndanangnysen"? he appears to be a rather busy person and i wouldn't be surprised if he had been banned on many another one


Definitely very busy. Seems to be spreading the same crap everywhere and getting banned for it in most places. Rather disappointing that he doesn't even learn from the encounters so that he bring a stronger game.

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marnixR
Post  Post subject: Re: How come we never went to the moon?  |  Posted: Fri Jul 31, 2015 8:53 pm
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once you've been on a number of science forums you start to develop a sixth sense for the undesirables and the pseudo-science merchants, and any forum worth its salt would quickly cleanse themselves of this type of member

on the other hand, Ryndanangnysen probably just thinks he's being victimised and is already developing the next conspiracy theory of how big science is trying to keep out the plucky little guys like him

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Falconer360
Post  Post subject: Re: How come we never went to the moon?  |  Posted: Fri Jul 31, 2015 10:32 pm
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marnixR wrote:
on the other hand, Ryndanangnysen probably just thinks he's being victimised and is already developing the next conspiracy theory of how big science is trying to keep out the plucky little guys like him


Yep, we're all out to science the "truth" ;) I bet he probably has a personal blog somewhere where he chronicles his fights against the big bad science guys that are trying to silence him.

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Snafuperman
Post  Post subject: Re: How come we never went to the moon?  |  Posted: Sun Sep 27, 2015 5:03 pm

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With so few active members, it's a shame the forum has to put up with these crackpots. :evil:


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iNow
Post  Post subject: Re: How come we never went to the moon?  |  Posted: Sun Sep 27, 2015 5:41 pm
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True, but we should also acknowledge that crackpots and trolls and even conscientious objectors drive activity and lead to engaged often enjoyable discussion. A site where everyone simply agrees all of the time gets boring in a hurry.

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Snafuperman
Post  Post subject: Re: How come we never went to the moon?  |  Posted: Sun Sep 27, 2015 5:53 pm

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iNow wrote:
True, but we should also acknowledge that crackpots and trolls and even conscientious objectors drive activity and lead to engaged often enjoyable discussion. A site where everyone simply agrees all of the time gets boring in a hurry.


I guess. As long as it can be a rational discussion. But it's a bit depressing when someone (like the someone in this thread) says:

Quote:
How come the moon rocks where fake? How is that for evidence?


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marnixR
Post  Post subject: Re: How come we never went to the moon?  |  Posted: Sun Sep 27, 2015 9:03 pm
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iNow wrote:
A site where everyone simply agrees all of the time gets boring in a hurry.


i disagree :mrgreen:

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Snafuperman
Post  Post subject: Re: How come we never went to the moon?  |  Posted: Sun Sep 27, 2015 9:24 pm

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marnixR wrote:
iNow wrote:
A site where everyone simply agrees all of the time gets boring in a hurry.


i disagree :mrgreen:

Ha Ha.

I saw that in a movie not too long ago. People were having a meeting around a table and were arguing. In a lull, one guy says "we can't agree on anything." Another then retorts "I disagree!"


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Moontanman
Post  Post subject: Re: How come we never went to the moon?  |  Posted: Mon Sep 28, 2015 8:12 pm
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It's ALIENS! ALIENS I TELL YOU! IT'S ALL ALIENS ALL THE TIME 24/7 LIVE NAKKED ALIENS! oops that would be strippers not aliens, never mind...

Hey guys, sorry I've been gone so long, now back to aliens... on the moon! Yes, we didn't go to the moon because aliens wouldn't let us, it's all so obvious anyone should be able to see it...


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marnixR
Post  Post subject: Re: How come we never went to the moon?  |  Posted: Mon Sep 28, 2015 9:14 pm
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obviously they must be cheese-eating aliens (i.e. french ?), trying to monopolize the cheese trade for their own nefarious purposes

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Snafuperman
Post  Post subject: Re: How come we never went to the moon?  |  Posted: Mon Sep 28, 2015 10:19 pm

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Blessed are the cheese makers.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-xLUEMj6cwA


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Falconer360
Post  Post subject: Re: How come we never went to the moon?  |  Posted: Thu Oct 01, 2015 4:08 pm
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The Cheese cartel... worse than the Diamond Cartel. They'll sic their Muenster on you! :lol:

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wegs
Post  Post subject: Re: How come we never went to the moon?  |  Posted: Wed May 25, 2016 10:02 pm
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To the OP, everything is a conspiracy theory, eh?


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Moontanman
Post  Post subject: Re: How come we never went to the moon?  |  Posted: Wed May 25, 2016 10:49 pm
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The real reason we never went back to the moon!



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Robittybob1
Post  Post subject: Re: How come we never went to the moon?  |  Posted: Wed May 25, 2016 11:13 pm

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Moontanman wrote:
The real reason we never went back to the moon!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YRSk8zsddSM

Some aspects of that film are true.


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Moontanman
Post  Post subject: Re: How come we never went to the moon?  |  Posted: Thu May 26, 2016 1:31 am
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Robittybob1 wrote:
Moontanman wrote:
The real reason we never went back to the moon!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YRSk8zsddSM

Some aspects of that film are true.



Which ones?


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astromark2014
Post  Post subject: Re: How come we never went to the moon?  |  Posted: Thu May 26, 2016 1:51 am
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Snafuperman wrote:
marnixR wrote:
iNow wrote:
A site where everyone simply agrees all of the time gets boring in a hurry.


i disagree :mrgreen:

Ha Ha.

I saw that in a movie not too long ago. People were having a meeting around a table and were arguing. In a lull, one guy says "we can't agree on anything." Another then retorts "I disagree!"


~ I like that.~

The actual subject is obviously just wrong.. I would ask of a explanation of what is 'we' in this regard. Because if we is humanity we obviously went to the Moon and we went back there.. From the first manned mission out there being Apollo 8 and right on through to Apollo 17.. but unmanned missions have and still are active on and around the Earth's Moon.
Tweaking the meaning to ~ 'why have we not been back', is entirely dependant on what you mean by 'we'.

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Robittybob1
Post  Post subject: Re: How come we never went to the moon?  |  Posted: Thu May 26, 2016 3:19 am

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astromark2014 wrote:
...
The actual subject is obviously just wrong.. I would ask of a explanation of what is 'we' in this regard. Because if we is humanity we obviously went to the Moon and we went back there.. From the first manned mission out there being Apollo 8 and right on through to Apollo 17.. but unmanned missions have and still are active on and around the Earth's Moon.
Tweaking the meaning to ~ 'why have we not been back', is entirely dependant on what you mean by 'we'.


When the conspiracy theorist say "we never went to the Moon" they seem to focus on the first Moon landing don't they? Or are they meaning all of the Apollo missions?


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plusminusgravity
Post  Post subject: Re: How come we never went to the moon?  |  Posted: Thu May 26, 2016 6:03 pm
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Could a person actually believe we didn't go to the moon?

What part of anything that's happening today in science
would lead towards evidence that we wouldn't of been
able to?

More importantly what's the true value of knowing we
did or didn't?

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astromark2014
Post  Post subject: Re: How come we never went to the moon?  |  Posted: Thu May 26, 2016 9:22 pm
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~ Bob; Those people who doubt the Lunar landing of Apollo 11 would have no knowledge of 12 to 17. and probably think the Earth is flat. pfft..

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Robittybob1
Post  Post subject: Re: How come we never went to the moon?  |  Posted: Thu May 26, 2016 9:29 pm

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astromark2014 wrote:
~ Bob; Those people who doubt the Lunar landing of Apollo 11 would have no knowledge of 12 to 17. and probably think the Earth is flat. pfft..


I cheered the day man landed on the Moon, but later I too joined the skeptics. Now I'm a fence sitter on the matter of the first luna landing.
When they said all the video tapes of the landing had been erased (whatever) that just seemed to make the truth even harder to find.


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Moontanman
Post  Post subject: Re: How come we never went to the moon?  |  Posted: Thu May 26, 2016 9:56 pm
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Ummm... the landers can be seen by orbiting space craft, more importantly even the tire prints and disturbed regolith, and the reflectors they left behind can be identified by lasers...


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iNow
Post  Post subject: Re: How come we never went to the moon?  |  Posted: Thu May 26, 2016 9:59 pm
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Some posts above have been removed for being OT and personal in nature

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Robittybob1
Post  Post subject: Re: How come we never went to the moon?  |  Posted: Fri May 27, 2016 12:08 am

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Moontanman wrote:
Ummm... the landers can be seen by orbiting space craft, more importantly even the tire prints and disturbed regolith, and the reflectors they left behind can be identified by lasers...

Were they from the first mission? I did see the tire tracks from a later mission.


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astromark2014
Post  Post subject: Re: How come we never went to the moon?  |  Posted: Fri May 27, 2016 9:50 am
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The Lunar Orbiter has photographed all the Apollo sites. A quick check in to NASA Photo's will reveal all.
The Moon is and has been the study subject of many craft. To openly state you are sitting on the fence as to humans having been there..

Where's my Thor's Hammer .. You need some convincing; Really ? Do some research that does NOT include random You-tube bullsh-- ;)
I watched and followed the whole build up to get Man on the Moon.. from the Gemini craft, right after the mercury craft and onto the mighty Saturn 5's..
Missions testing and pushing docking and re docking .. The near tragedy of Apollo 13 and the gear returned from the Moon..
You are a man of science. How can you not be sure ?

Do you suggest for a moment that the USSR would have been beaten to the Moon by a lie.. No. It is not I that is being silly.
Silly is being in denial of what we know happened.

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Robittybob1
Post  Post subject: Re: How come we never went to the moon?  |  Posted: Fri May 27, 2016 11:45 am

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astromark2014 wrote:
The Lunar Orbiter has photographed all the Apollo sites. A quick check in to NASA Photo's will reveal all.
The Moon is and has been the study subject of many craft. To openly state you are sitting on the fence as to humans having been there..

Where's my Thor's Hammer .. You need some convincing; Really ? Do some research that does NOT include random You-tube bullsh-- ;)
I watched and followed the whole build up to get Man on the Moon.. from the Gemini craft, right after the mercury craft and onto the mighty Saturn 5's..
Missions testing and pushing docking and re docking .. The near tragedy of Apollo 13 and the gear returned from the Moon..
You are a man of science. How can you not be sure ?

Do you suggest for a moment that the USSR would have been beaten to the Moon by a lie.. No. It is not I that is being silly.
Silly is being in denial of what we know happened.


There were arguments from both sides, and I have looked at both sides and found that to be fully convinced it would take a lot of research, so I have assigned that effort to the too hard basket.


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paleoichneum
Post  Post subject: Re: How come we never went to the moon?  |  Posted: Fri May 27, 2016 1:12 pm
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Robittybob1 wrote:
There were arguments from both sides, and I have looked at both sides and found that to be fully convinced it would take a lot of research, so I have assigned that effort to the too hard basket.

What arguments on the "didn't happen" side have ANY credibility?

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Robittybob1
Post  Post subject: Re: How come we never went to the moon?  |  Posted: Fri May 27, 2016 6:09 pm

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paleoichneum wrote:
Robittybob1 wrote:
There were arguments from both sides, and I have looked at both sides and found that to be fully convinced it would take a lot of research, so I have assigned that effort to the too hard basket.

What arguments on the "didn't happen" side have ANY credibility?

As I said the issue just got too complex and too difficult and I have put it aside, for some later time maybe. If another country sends a mission to the Moon and photographs the landers that will solve it. I'm not getting into this debate now.


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iNow
Post  Post subject: Re: How come we never went to the moon?  |  Posted: Fri May 27, 2016 6:27 pm
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Robittybob1 wrote:
As I said the issue just got too complex and too difficult and I have put it aside, for some later time maybe. If another country sends a mission to the Moon and photographs the landers that will solve it. I'm not getting into this debate now.

Except, you already have. You've made claims and then refused to back them up. That's against our rules.

Do you disavow all of your claims and concede that you were plainly wrong, or will you instead support your position and backup your assertions as all participants are expected to do here when asked?

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Robittybob1
Post  Post subject: Re: How come we never went to the moon?  |  Posted: Fri May 27, 2016 6:42 pm

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iNow wrote:
Robittybob1 wrote:
As I said the issue just got too complex and too difficult and I have put it aside, for some later time maybe. If another country sends a mission to the Moon and photographs the landers that will solve it. I'm not getting into this debate now.

Except, you already have. You've made claims and then refused to back them up. That's against our rules.

Do you disavow all of your claims and concede that you were plainly wrong, or will you instead support your position and backup your assertions as all participants are expected to do here when asked?

Could you show me what claims I made please?

I presume having an opinion is not considered a claim.


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iNow
Post  Post subject: Re: How come we never went to the moon?  |  Posted: Fri May 27, 2016 7:23 pm
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These are the two about which you were directly questioned and for which you've not yet shared a valid response:

Robittybob1 wrote:
Some aspects of that film are true.

Robittybob1 wrote:
There were arguments from both sides

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Robittybob1
Post  Post subject: Re: How come we never went to the moon?  |  Posted: Fri May 27, 2016 8:06 pm

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iNow wrote:
These are the two about which you were directly questioned and for which you've not yet shared a valid response:

Robittybob1 wrote:
Some aspects of that film are true.

Robittybob1 wrote:
There were arguments from both sides

I gave you my answer, why was it not accepted? posting.php?mode=quote&f=49&p=22277


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iNow
Post  Post subject: Re: How come we never went to the moon?  |  Posted: Fri May 27, 2016 8:14 pm
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Robittybob1 wrote:
I gave you my answer, why was it not accepted? posting.php?mode=quote&f=49&p=22277


The question: What specific aspects of the film are you claiming are true?

Your response: It was a baked bean ad and they make you fart. It's uncomfortable.

The question: You claimed there were arguments from both sides. What are you saying are the credible ones on the side of the moon landing being faked?

Your response: Both conspiracy theorists and nonconspiracy theorists say things.


You have failed to even remotely address either. Try again.

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"[Time] is one of those concepts that is profoundly resistant to a simple definition." ~C. Sagan


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Robittybob1
Post  Post subject: Re: How come we never went to the moon?  |  Posted: Fri May 27, 2016 8:23 pm

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iNow wrote:
Robittybob1 wrote:
I gave you my answer, why was it not accepted? posting.php?mode=quote&f=49&p=22277


The question: What specific aspects of the film are you claiming are true?

Your response: It was a baked bean ad and they make you fart. It's uncomfortable.

The question: You claimed there were arguments from both sides. What are you saying are the credible ones on the side of the moon landing being faked?

Your response: Both conspiracy theorists and nonconspiracy theorists say things.


You have failed to even remotely address either. Try again.

I also said I don't want to go into the details of the arguments ATM. The explanation about the baked bean ad is correct. I can't add anything to that.


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iNow
Post  Post subject: Re: How come we never went to the moon?  |  Posted: Fri May 27, 2016 8:27 pm
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Robittybob1 wrote:
I also said I don't want to go into the details of the arguments ATM.

You've said that, but you also entered this discussion as a participant and were asked direct questions. Are you now refusing to respond to those direct questions (despite your obviously available time to do so given all of your subsequent off-topic replies)?

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Robittybob1
Post  Post subject: Re: How come we never went to the moon?  |  Posted: Fri May 27, 2016 8:34 pm

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iNow wrote:
Robittybob1 wrote:
I also said I don't want to go into the details of the arguments ATM.

You've said that, but you also entered this discussion as a participant and were asked direct questions. Are you now refusing to respond to those direct questions (despite your obviously available time to do so given all of your subsequent off-topic replies)?

Those direct questions were not questions about claims I made. I was just detailing my history on the subject. It was a matter of opinion, and I'm currently undecided.

[How do I make reference to a previous post? I have made two attempts and neither have worked.]


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paleoichneum
Post  Post subject: Re: How come we never went to the moon?  |  Posted: Sat May 28, 2016 3:40 pm
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Robittybob1 wrote:
iNow wrote:
Robittybob1 wrote:
I also said I don't want to go into the details of the arguments ATM.

You've said that, but you also entered this discussion as a participant and were asked direct questions. Are you now refusing to respond to those direct questions (despite your obviously available time to do so given all of your subsequent off-topic replies)?

Those direct questions were not questions about claims I made. I was just detailing my history on the subject. It was a matter of opinion, and I'm currently undecided.

[How do I make reference to a previous post? I have made two attempts and neither have worked.]

This is one of the EXACT behaviors that gets you the boot on other sites. You make an assertion, get questioned, then whine insistently you have no time, but are on constantly posting on other topics. Its clear you do NOT want to actually address the question. Why should you be allowed to do this?

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